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 False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica

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barnaba6
Cos Des II
Cos Des II


Age : 34
Date d'inscription : 24/02/2015

False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Empty
MessageSujet: False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica   False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Icon_minitimeVen 6 Avr - 11:18

It is with great surprise and disappointment that I noted yesterday that the most prestigious auction house in the world as far as ancient numismatics is concerned put on auction the below falsification of the famous Probus Calliope Avg:

https://www.sixbid.com/browse.html?auction=4763&category=140860&lot=3928531

While the obverse is most likely genuine, the reverse is evidently false! The style of the Muse and the shape of the letters have nothing in common with the original.

You can check yourselves what the originals look like:

http://probuscoins.fr/search?atelierID=-1&dateID=-1&titulatureID=-1&legendeID=21&reversType=-1&emission=-1&officineID=-1&busteID=-1&ric=-1&bastien=-1&mpr=-1&ho=-1&rarityID=-1&id=&keywords=

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Brennos
COS V
COS V
Brennos

Age : 47
Date d'inscription : 27/02/2012

False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Empty
MessageSujet: Re: False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica   False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Icon_minitimeVen 6 Avr - 11:30

It is not the first time that forgeries are offered on NAC auctions. If you signal it, they withdraw them.

They have catalogued 1726 coins and they are human after all ...
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barnaba6
Cos Des II
Cos Des II


Age : 34
Date d'inscription : 24/02/2015

False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Empty
MessageSujet: Re: False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica   False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Icon_minitimeVen 6 Avr - 12:19

I just wrote to them. We will see if and how they react, especially if they withdraw the coin.
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Emblémiste
Légendaire Modérateur
Légendaire Modérateur
Emblémiste

Age : 81
Localisation : Brasilia
Date d'inscription : 22/12/2007

False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Empty
MessageSujet: Re: False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica   False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Icon_minitimeVen 6 Avr - 13:14

Isn't it possible that the aspect of the reverse be the result of a bad strike?  The coin is cracked.

It sounds strange to me that the obverse is genuine and the reverse is false. heink
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barnaba6
Cos Des II
Cos Des II


Age : 34
Date d'inscription : 24/02/2015

False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Empty
MessageSujet: Re: False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica   False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Icon_minitimeVen 6 Avr - 13:51

[quote="Emblémiste"]Isn't it possible that the aspect of the reverse be the result of a bad strike?  The coin is cracked.

It sounds strange to me that the obverse is genuine and the reverse is false.quote]

The coin is cracked but the crack has nothing to do with the strange style of the Muse and the lettering.

I suspect the reverse was re-engraved from a genuine coin of another type, hence the (most likely) genuine obverse, similarily as another "Calliope" discussed some time ago on this forum:

http://www.forumfw.com/t5798-pour-nos-amis-probusiens-type-calliope-avg?highlight=calliope

http://www.forumancientcoins.com/board/index.php?topic=65034.0



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Pescennius
Prefet de l'Vrbs
Prefet de l'Vrbs
Pescennius

Age : 31
Date d'inscription : 17/02/2015

False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Empty
MessageSujet: Re: False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica   False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Icon_minitimeVen 6 Avr - 14:15

Tu as raison Barnaba, ton hypothèse me semble la bonne.
Il y a d'ailleurs une grande similitude de style de "regravure"... l'oeuvre du même escroc sans doute.
False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Callio10
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barnaba6
Cos Des II
Cos Des II


Age : 34
Date d'inscription : 24/02/2015

False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Empty
MessageSujet: Re: False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica   False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Icon_minitimeVen 6 Avr - 15:52

Thanks Pescennius for this very nice photo "assemblage". I think that in this case images speak louder than words:)

By the way, the coin which you chose to show as the original, comes from my collection and I am very dearly attached to it:)
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Pescennius
Prefet de l'Vrbs
Prefet de l'Vrbs
Pescennius

Age : 31
Date d'inscription : 17/02/2015

False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Empty
MessageSujet: Re: False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica   False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Icon_minitimeVen 6 Avr - 18:17

Waooh, great coin Barnaba ! You can be proud of it ! super8
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Joss
COS VII
COS VII
Joss

Age : 30
Localisation : Lutèce
Date d'inscription : 17/09/2015

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MessageSujet: Re: False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica   False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Icon_minitimeVen 6 Avr - 20:41

Numismatists are mostly specialised in Greek, Republican or early Imperial coinages. Thus they are a bit clueless about the Late Empire. It seems forgers have understood that.
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KRIKRI58
Prefet de l'Vrbs
Prefet de l'Vrbs
KRIKRI58

Age : 63
Localisation : Amphiacum entre Decetia et Noviodunum
Date d'inscription : 01/12/2012

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MessageSujet: Re: False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica   False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Icon_minitimeDim 8 Avr - 16:47

Sont même pas fichu d'identifier l'avers correctement :
IMP CM AVR PROBVS PF AVG et non IMP PROBVS PF AVG comme annoncé
https://www.sixbid.com/browse.html?auction=4763&category=140860&lot=3928531
Toujours en ligne

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Pescennius
Prefet de l'Vrbs
Prefet de l'Vrbs
Pescennius

Age : 31
Date d'inscription : 17/02/2015

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MessageSujet: Re: False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica   False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Icon_minitimeDim 8 Avr - 22:39

Tiens, étrange, car elle avait été retirée, et là, on la revoit.
Une remise en vente, c'est pas sain, car ils ont été avertis. grr2

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MessageSujet: Re: False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica   False Calliope Avg offered by Numismatica Ars Classica Icon_minitime

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